Friday, September 14, 2007
Renaissance Blog #1 Week 9/17-9/21
A common assumption is that creative work proceeds best in periods of calm and peace. Give the combination of political instability and cultural productivity in Renaissance Italy, do you think this assumption is valid? (Remember to respond to the question in 4-6 sentences and to respond to two of your classmates answers. Do not just agree or disagree without defending or justifying your argument.)
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During the renaissance in Italy, new products and inventions appeared. The politcal power grew rapidly in Italy. Italy became a highly succesful land due to its location. It happened to be the center spot of all trading throughout this time. The cultural productivity grew because of the new items that were either remastered or reinvented to increase its value. Lastly, I do believe this assumption is valid.
Hm...I disagree w/Phillip. I think that political instability has everything to do with cultural productivity. Take the middle ages and anything pre-Renaissance for example. They were a period of virtually no creative/innovative expression because of the continual chaos and interruption, from plagues to wars. In addition, all 4 of the factors (political, religious, social, economic)were also hindrances for the people during the middle ages because:
1.) The State - Anything that happened to offend or contradict the State was seen as treason and the person was executed. Therefore, all artwork, literature, etc, was "king friendly," and portrayed the monarchy inasmuch glory as possible.
2.) The Church - Anything that happened to offend or contradict the Bible/Catholic church's word was considered heresy and the person was executed. Therefore all artwork, literature, etc, was "Clergy Friendly" and portrayed the Pope and his subordinates inasmuch glory as possible.
Not that the "execution" factor was diminished or anything, but it seemed more "ignored."
3.) Social: In addition to the Church & State, any social factors such as the Bubonic Plague were probably not the most "inspiring" of times. Because people's minds were dedicated solely to survival or the survival of a family member, such creativity and development was scarce.
Economic: Simple, because money was tight, there was no room for frivolity. Most worked for feudal lords and henceforth had no time to paint, write, think of new schools of thought.
So in summation, periods of calm and peace DO in turn effect the production of creativity and innovation.
Jordan is this your response to Philips and your response to the blog. Be sure to distinguish between the two by making it clear that your responding to one of your classmates and that your responding to the blog. Good Luck. Your classmates are bogging down the blog lets get everyone blogging.
Peace and calm... Creative pieces of art.. Well Mr. Neal, you mention political instability and cultural productivity. Well during this time weren't some of the greatest artists and sculptors around and didn't they create some of the greatest pieces of art even to this day?
Now if you were to put this question in a different.. I don't know the word.. perspective? Maybe it would change my answer. People do create more art during calm/peaceful times. After all, don't you think you would be able to concentrate on your paintings instead of worrying about rocks coming through your window and your building being raided by foreigners that are trying to take over your country?
During the Renaissance I'm kind of stuck in the neutral zone. If it were elsewhere I would say yes, more art is produced during calm times.
I'll respond to two other people when more people respond.
Be sure to focus on the question and give concrete examples. If I wanted you to include me in the blog I would have asked. Make sure you focus on the question and try not to get too side tracked. Remember some individuals work better when they can reflect on their surroundings and if nothing is going on...wel I'll leave that up to you to figure out.
umm...does anyone want to meet at the library thursday to study for the test thing on monday?
Alrighty then...here goes.
My own opinion:
I don't agree that the statement is always valid. Times of chaos and war are a great time for inspiration: people will create art that portrays their opinions, their hopes, etc. Time of peace is a better time, in my opinion, to make weapons. Just in case. (Kidding! Kidding...) The reason I say "always valid" is that I agree that having time on your hands for art is definitly easier in times of peace. So, either way, there's an argument and I agree either way.
My comments:
1} Jordan, I like your reasoning. It's a good, well thought out argument and i agree with just about all of it.
2) This one will wait until more people blog.
A side note:
Hey Jordan, what time did you want to study on Thursday?
All done!:D
I was probably going to do it tomorrow in the library. After school perhaps 3 to 4:00/4:30?
And: My comments-
Hailey - Totally agree. Peace is for weapons making (chuckle, chuckle).
DjAndy (who is that?) - Umm...i believe that peace is simply more convenient not exactly necessary, but makes things somewhat simpler. =)
The statement is valid because some of the greatest art was created during the Renaissance. After all the choas was over, there was peace again. People started to be more creative. The number of sculptors increased and people valued education more. As a result, people became more advanced in art.
I disagree with the statement. Although i admit it can be true occasionally but otherwise creative works do not always proceed calm and peace. They can follow chaos as well. Before the Renaissance, the middle ages were full of chaos and it seems that the artistic changes took place because of that chaos.
the political instability and only added to that chaos. cultural productivity was increased due to the political instability
in response to jordans examples, I agree the creativity was limited because of the fear of the church, kings and dying from the black plague.
in response to haleys comments i agree with the fact that at calm periods people are more likely to work on arts or literature because they are not completely preoccupied with whatever distactions are going on.
i believe chaos as well as a calm and peacefull settng can jump start creativity.
Responses (:
1) i agree with DJAndy32 when he said that you can concentrate more on your art when you dont have to worry about anything else. it is definately easier to create art when there is peace, and you dont have to be constantly worrying about something bad happening.
2) hailey: chaos can bring inspiration and different opinions. i want to agree with this too because war can bring new ideas and people can express their opinions through their art.
so yeah, i agree with both?
My opinion:
In my opinion, I think the assumption is not valid because during the period time of calm and peace, people were in their same routine everyday. Basically just work, sleep, and eat, nothing was really that interested for them to create a piece of great work. However, I know there are a lot of artists, who created great harmony work/pieces, but during the period of wars and chaos, people actually have more ideas/opinions that they would like to express through their arts, such as politic issues during their time.
People in the middle ages had no thoughts. They were not allowed to question the church and create whatever; otherwise they would be considered as a heretic. Basically, the church had a standard for the people to follow. During the Renaissance, which was the period of time when the kings and the church were fighting for political power, people started to lose trust to the church because they did not know if they should listen to the church or the king. So therefore, people started to depend on themselves. They started creating work that they were not supposed to and eventually, that led people to start exploring the world of arts and it is also the time when most of the creative works were created because they gained knowledge through their explorations. In addition, if people were in peace, nothing new would be created; people need to be challenged in order to come up with new ideas and inventions. For example, if there were no conflicts in political power (calm and peace), there would be no Renaissance, if there were no Renaissance, then we wouldn’t be the way we’re today. Lastly, I do not agree that the assumption is a valid statement.
Comments:
Hailey - I agree with you because I also think that the time of chaos and wars can be an inspiration to some artists. For example, Albrecht Durer's piece, which is called "Knight, Death and Devil" and the "Miracle of the Slave" by Tintoretto reflect the chaos during their time and or what they desires for.=)
Andres – I am sorry that I have to disagree with you saying that “don't you think you would be able to concentrate on your paintings instead of worrying about rocks coming through your window and your building being raided by foreigners that are trying to take over your country?” because there is not a true time of calm and peace. Who will know what is going to happen in the next minute? How do you know that there will be a tsunami in the next five minutes? There are always accidents that we can’t expect them to happen and we are unable to worry all the events that hasn’t been happen yet.=)
Jordan – Do you know what the exam will be on? I know it is a geography exam but I want to know specifically what the exam will be on. In addition, we should bring our study guide to work on it as a group too.
=)
abby: I believe artistic changes occurred because at the same time a lot of other things were being changed. The Renaissance happened not just because people that there was a lack of 'good' art.
daisy: Some of the greatest art created during the Renaissance wasn't that focused on just Politics. It still revolved around Church-themes. How can you say that people would rather draw a picture of some of the battles during these times rather than draw a picture of good ol' Jesus? Remember that people still are heavily influenced by the Church.
And well, it's more like this: Imagine if you're city is dead center of a war. You live in a territory that other people want. Your country is deep in war. How could you not expect to be attacked? Didn't most artists live in heavily populated areas known for good commerce, etc? :D
I believe that creative works can be better found in times of peace than trouble. People in Italy did not have to worry about finding sponsors to fund them to create works of art. During the Renaissance people were not as worried about being critized by the church, unless it contridicted their beliefs or standards. Actually, the church favored great artists to paint grand works of art such as the "Last Supper".
Usually, if there are any troubles or crises in the area of an artist, he, maybe she, may create works of art that portrays the event. Most likely it will not be grand like the Mona Lisa or other famous paintings due to stress. Also an artist will most likely be more worried about his well-being. If there was plague near him/her, for example, he/she would be more occupied with quarantine or escape.
1) I agree with Hailey that times of chaos will bring out hope in some people to create, but not everyone can stay focused enough to create a masterpiece.
2) I also agree with Esther because the Renaissance was a time of peace and harmony in most areas of Europe. People were not pressured as much during this time, and this caused mental peace and serenity.
Response to jordan fudge:
I agree to jordans response to pj butta #13 the reason for this is that I belive that the collapsing governments aided and sparked the explotions of artisains and there craft.
With the structural instiblity of the Italian government the artisains and there work prospered. New and old styles of paintings, statues, and apparel/jewlery flurished due to the collapsing government and agruculteral slump.
This would contrast to the Middle Ages through the early Renaissance. That the corrupt powers of the church and kings prospered as the culteral industry trived for stability. As the heart of the Renaissance was a complete negative.
Will respond to one more when i have a wider varienty.
Jordan:
if you get this befor thursday I will be in the library at the alloted time Devon. and does this mean that the group cant go hange at your house?
i don't agree that people have "better" work when it's peaceful. A lot of people learn from the things around them and sometimes chaos can be very helpful. the "chaos" can help people improve on arts and things like that. it helps them to be more creative and learn from the things around them.
btw... am i doing this right? haha i'm kind of confused. my answer might not make any sense... but this is just my opinion.
i agree with jordan's first comment. the part under "social". people during that time were more concerned about their family so they didn't really have much time to be creative with arts and other things. so i really agree with a lot of stuff that you said...
I believe this assumption is valid in many ways. Not only was art the cause of the renaissance but also was technology, and education. These subjects did not develop till the chaos had ended. How is it possible to form mathematical equations when, there are people screaming on the streets and dying of diseases? In other words to come up with such brilliant works you must have a calm understanding mind. Sure u can make a sculpture when there is chaos out and about the streets, but its no going to be better than someone who was calm and free of mind. Because the chaos had ended there was a dramatic improvement and developments in art, literature, science, technology, technology, exploration and trade. In conclusion many of these subject couldn't have been developed in a time of instability and chaos.
I agree with Esther because, not many paintings and art became so famous in the middle ages, but in the renaissance. Nothing that important was developed in the middle ages that impacted us in the long run.
I also agree with Daisy because her statement is true up to a certain point. she said, "If people were in peace, nothing new would be created; people need to be challenged in order to come up with new ideas and inventions." But how can u create a work of art when you are dying of a disease. What if you were starving. The only thing on your mind is to get some food.....right?
I disagree with the statement.
When there is chaos, people have to come up with new ways on how to express their opinions and construct new methods of how to operate a business without drawing the attention of the state or church. During the Renaissance many business had to procure new and creative ways to expand without inciting a scandal with the state and artists had to invent new tactics of conveying their conceptions of current events and philosophy through art without disgruntling the church.
1)i disagree with djandy32 on the idea that creative work is produced best in time of peace. creativity doesn't necessarily apply to art only. It can apply to economy as well since having a war upon their country forced the "bosses" to make new ways of running a business
2) i agree with H that "Times of chaos and war are a great time for inspiration: people will create art that portrays their opinions, their hopes, etc."
yaahooo!
I feel that creativity does thrive in unusual environments, such as in Italy, given its political instability. However, there is a limit. Once life began to get far too difficult for the citizens, they shut down the creative part of the brain completely, and just worked on surviving. That is why in The Middle Ages, there is a standstill to art and intellectual progress, but it starts again during the Renaissance. AKA once life started getting easier. But when life is TOO easy, we start getting lazy, and less creative. In my opinon, art hasn't changed very drastically in modern times, like nowadays, compared to how quickly art changed style in the 1400-1500's. So yeah, if a time is too calm, we aren't very creative.
As for the other people...
1) Jordan, you claim that creative work cannot proceed in a chaotic time, yet Renaissance Italy had political instablity.
2) Esther, you too, the Renaissance was still not a completely "peaceful" time.
I disagree with the assumption that creative work proceeds in periods of calm and peace. If there was no political instability and everything was calm, then artists wouldn't have anything to derive their inspiration from. Artists somewhat expressed wars and the political instability through their work. In the Middle Ages, people weren’t allowed to make anything creative becasue of the Church. Even under the pressure of economic failure through war helped create new works of art. For example, The Mona Lisa and the Last Supper were created during the political instability.
-During the Renaissance, while people were fighting for power all of the artists soared. Many great artists like Leonardo da Vinci, Michelangelo, and Tinteretto's "Miracle of the Slave." The greatest works of art were produced during the chaos. Under the pressure of political instability, religious observations and speculations, people created some of the world's most famous paintings. Distractions act as inspiration and artists thrive on not just concentration alone.
Comments:
Daisy- I completely agree with what she said about how if people weren't challenged then no new inventions or ideas wouldn't have occurred. Also if there wasn't chaos then the Renaissance wouldn't have formed.
djandy32- I disagree with that art was best created in periods of calm and peace. You stated that people wouldn't be able to concentrate on their work. Peace isn't completely necessary for great minds to work. Art was produced during the chaos.
I disagree with the statement. If you look at the time period of the Renaissance you will see that it was very unstable indeed.. There was chaos in every aspect of life and people still were learning and growing. An example of this is if you look at the constant fighting between Church and State. Even though there was turmoil the people still lived their lives.
Megha- I strongly agree with what she said. It is very true that artists wouldn't have any sources of inspiration without conflict.
Daisy- I agree with Daisy as well. if people had calm and peace in their everday routines then nothing would come of it. People need a little bit of conflict to have new ideas.
I disagree with the statment, I think usually during a time of chaos and corruption
it inspires more artists to create art they really feel,strongly about. It's kind of like singers who are lyric writers as wel, one of the best songs are usually created during a time in their life that isnt going all to well. So they write and sing the way they really feel. I guess sometimes people do create art pieces when there is peace, but when artists wrote or drew, thats because they really had something to say, not just because.
This assumption can't always be valid. The Renaissance didn't necessarily follow up with calm and peace. Previous of the Renaissance, the middle ages dealt with intense chaos. Due to all the chaos and conflicts, it appeared that "works" modified most during that time. It allowed artists, scupltors, inventors, etc. to explore their thoughts of various ideas to create. In addition, they were able to express themselves with exstensive creativity. Not much productive and interesting works would have been created with just peace and tranquility. Political instability had much to do with the rise of cultural productivity. Political instability added onto all the chaotic things that were occuring and all that did was increase the cultural productivity.
Response to Sri Lankan:
I disagree with your disagreement towards daisy. You implied that you believe people who were dying of a disease, it would be hard creating a work of art since they would be focusing more on their illness or life. Think of whomever that person who carried a disease, create a piece of art, then the future would hold such meaninful and strong work not only because that person had thoughts and opinions of their own, but furthermore the experience of dying of a disease. The creation could have shown how they felt or the appearence of which they appeared. Things like that need to be in consideration.
Response to paulina mendoza:
I agree about your statement. i do too believe that at the time of chaos and corruption, artists freely have the opportunity to express themselves throughout their art.
I disagree with this assumption because many people tend to express their creativity through what is happening around them. During the time of common peace, people often go on about their normal life and do not stop to think about creating anything. But when chaos is happening all around them, a natural idea comes to them allowing the person to freely express their opinion about the chaos going on in their environment. For example, during the Renaissance era there was a lot of religious unrest in Europe and this led to the reformation which can be argued as a creative element because it created a whole new branch of Christianity.
Megha Shah: I agree with her that if everything was peaceful then the artist wouldn't have much to get their inspiration from.
Evan: I disagree with him that an artist might be worried about his "well-being" just because a plague was coming toward his way because this just might inspire the artist to express to the people how he feels about the plague.
Resubmite for second oppinion on classmants work
I agree with srilanca and concure with the statement of that the economics and agruculture prospered as well.
:D C:
i agree with the quote. durring this time period there was so much going on and so much choas between the people. people can be more creative when they are not in places where there is so much going on like in the reniassance. The church was running just about everything back then which put them in every high power, which made the political aspect very unstable.
i agree with taylor's quote. like i also said there was much choas which made the time very unstable and less productivity.
i also agree with ester. that people are more able to concentrate on art and litiature when there is peace and clam.
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